A weekend without Members Lounge :-(

keithgood838 · Post by **keithgood838** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 6:15 pm

Hi Jon,
To recap on our practise and practice debate.
Although it depends on the sense in which either
is used, on reflection your contention that I should
have written practice is more accurate in the
context of the phrase. The present participle verb,
writing, is preferred juxtaposed with the noun, practice.
I may need to practise the use of the noun, practice.
Well done, mate, and thanks.
Keith

keithgood838 · Post by **keithgood838** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:45 pm

Hi L&H,
I love you both, especially for you wordplaying abilities.
I hope the following tickles you joint linguistic funny bone.

JOURNEY'S END

Nouns terminal and terminus
are usually synonymous,
except that terminal receives planes,
while terminus welcomes train or bus.
And perhaps the distinction explains
the coded message sent to us?

Keith

Note. Terminus, meaning end-point, is the Roman
god of boundaries. Terminal is also an adjective
that means, 'leading to death'.

Lena & Harry Smith · Post by **Lena & Harry Smith** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:28 pm

Hi Keith, yes, very interesting, it's strange how we often fail to connect words and then they make sense.
The word Hospital can tickle our funny bone, meaning hospitality, and very generous and accomodating they can be too. For instance, no need to ask twice for infection .

keithgood838 · Post by **keithgood838** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:19 pm

Hi again Lena & Harry,
I feel hospitable towards your hospital comments.
Apparently hostel was the forerunner of both.
I have titled my book project, Rhymes & Reasons.
The following set the ball rolling:

HYPHEN FAMILY LIFE

The nascent infant records
its arrival by linking
made-for-wedlock words,
a child born of literary coupling.

Soon, bored in this adult milieu,
the fledgling has flown,
leaving its parents to continue
as one, on their own.

Keith Good

Note. The hyphen is literature's lollipop lady
whose raison d'etre is to safeguard literature's
offspring. If you were to write: twenty-odd politicians
comprised the House of Commons select committee
and you omitted the hyphen, you wouldn't endear
yourself to your political masters; on the other hand
you wouldn't lose much sleep over it.

jon · Post by **jon** » Thu May 01, 2008 3:43 pm

I've only just caught up again with this debate.

Keith, I'm glad to see you accept my position on 'practise/practice'. I have a professional interest in this as my job partly involves detailed editing and proofreading for an international law firm and so I am paid to know these things (but, of course, one is always learning).

"The Apprentice" last night involved a three-hour debate among the contestants on where to place the apostrophe in the phrase "Happy Singles Day" (or something similar). Eventually they decided to place it after the second 's' (so 'Singles''), which is technically correct in that the phrase is referring, in the possessive sense, to a collection of single people; however, this is one of those instances where it would also be correct to omit the apostrophe altogether. Indeed, did you know that there is actually an Apostrophe Protection Society?

michduncg · Post by **michduncg** » Thu May 01, 2008 5:12 pm

It was very odd that Michaels team didn't think of trying to use a dictionary but instead made demands of people on the telephone

Anyway. back to the internet problems. Did anyone see the News on C4 on monday when there was an interview with the guy from Oftel. Basically nobody is willing to upgrade our phone network to fibre-optics, and so the whole system is going to grind to a halt apparently! Whereas in France, they are about spend billions updating their infrastructure, but in Britain it looks like 'make do and mend' for now!

mariana44 · Post by **mariana44** » Thu May 01, 2008 6:25 pm

I thought that there should not have been an apostrophe anywhere.

keithgood838 · Post by **keithgood838** » Thu May 01, 2008 7:35 pm

Hi Jon,
Welcome back to the linguistic debate.
Your legal 'practice' background qualifies you,
inter alia, to comment on the use of that particular
noun. I must say it is refreshing to be in touch
with a kindred spirit; a rare breed as far as I am
concerned. I'm with Marian(a) in the apostrophe
debate; it should fully justify its inclusion. I knew
Keith Waterhouse was a founder member of the
Association for the Abolition of the Aberrant Apostrophe.
I had not heard of the APS, however. On the subject
of grammar, and for the benefit of folk who might be
intimidated by it, I am reminded of Keith Waterhouse's
perspicacious comment: 'The English language isn't
a drill-yard for grammarians.'
Keith

P.S. Where do you stand on the possible demise
of the semi-colon?

jon · Post by **jon** » Fri May 02, 2008 9:16 am

I can't help feeling Mike has left out the apostrophe in "Michaels" just to annoy me and then changed the subject for no apparent reason.

Keith, I'm all for semi-colons when used appropriately, but I didn't know they were under threat. I use them quite extensively in my job.

Marian · Post by **Marian** » Fri May 02, 2008 9:29 am

I wouldn't have used an apostrophe either on "Singles Day" as surely it's a plural, but on the follow up show they appeared to agree it should have been before the s.
Marian

keithgood838 · Post by **keithgood838** » Fri May 02, 2008 10:20 am

Hi Jon,
There is an ongoing debate on the subject of semi-colons.
Richard Hugo says: 'Semi-colons indicate relationships
that only idiots need defined by punctuation. Besides they
are ugly.' George Orwell, quoted in Lynne Truss's book,
'I had decided about this time that the semi-colon is an
unnecessary stop and I would write my next book without
one.' Kurt Vonnegut: 'Do not use semi-colons. They are
transvestite hermaphrodites, standing for absolutely nothing.
All they do is show you've been to college.'
A letter on the matter in the Guardian: 'I use them all
the time; well, nearly all the time.'
Keith

jon · Post by **jon** » Fri May 02, 2008 2:23 pm

Keith

It would be help your argument if you could cite examples of where abolition of the semi-colon would be appropriate, but the quotation you give from "The Guardian" is a good example of its correct usage.

Marian

The suggestion on "The Apprentice-You're Fired" that the apostrophe should have been placed before the second 's' was unequivocally WRONG as this would have referred to only one person when the intention was to indicate a collection of single people. It was made by a lady who apparently ran a successful card company herself - but I certainly wouldn't buy such a card from her.

keithgood838 · Post by **keithgood838** » Fri May 02, 2008 6:16 pm

Hi Jon,
My book project includes a separate piece on punctuation
in general, however the following extract deals with
the apostrophe specifically:

WORDWATCHING

The greater-spotted, aberrant apostrophe
pays homage to the goddess, Flora,
and is often found preening conspicuously
in the company of busy lizzy's, fuchsia's,
pansy's and other supplicants
at your local horticulturist's

It also appears fleetingly
among numeric decades
on television, and in the media generally,
even though its natural habitat
is a possessive world away from plurality.

Keith

Note. The foregoing exotic species
of floral punctuation were observed recently
adorning a reputable garden centre. Of course
they are apostrophe-free plurals and should read:
busy Lizzies, fuchsia and pansies.

mariana44 · Post by **mariana44** » Fri May 02, 2008 8:37 pm

Funny how straight away those plurals looked wrong.

One of my pet hates is when a person's name is written with inverted commas, when it is just not neccessary.

michduncg · Post by **michduncg** » Fri May 02, 2008 8:59 pm

I can't help feeling Mike has left out the apostrophe in "Michaels" just to annoy me and then changed the subject for no apparent reason.

Not really, I was changing the subject of this thread that I started BACK to the original issue, which was the growing problem with internet connection in the UK.