Jack Jones

[Mark Fox]

thanks for this review posting,Terence

[Gloria]

These reviews contain some interesting perspectives from across the Atlantic. I hope that this doesn't seem too negative, but I just wanted to point out that Jack Jones is perceived quite differently within the U.S.

Jack is NOT regarded as "American aristocracy" - not even close. Frank Sinatra and Tony Bennett - yes, they are, and will always be, beloved icons. Frank and Tony ALWAYS gave/give back, expressing appreciation towards fans, producers, arrangers and anyone who helped them along the way. Jack, by contrast, chose to disconnect from his American fan base of the 60's and 70's, and he's never looked back. He worked with the greatest talents in the industry when recording with Kapp, yet he rarely acknowledges a single name, and continues to speak disparagingly of how Kapp controlled his career and demanded that he sing in a pure pop style (which was what the record-buying public loved and wanted) - not an ounce of gratitude towards the record company and fans who made him a star.

(And, by the way, the Hollywood Walk of Fame is regarded as a joke in the U.S., since its stars are purchased by fan groups, not selected by merit or importance.)

When rock 'n' roll finally took over in the 70's, Jack could've chosen to stay in touch with his fan base through the summer ampitheatre circuit (as Johnny Mathis, Al Martino and others did). Instead, he chose to entertain only the well-heeled tourists in Vegas and many exclusive nightclubs on the coasts. Jack actually has a number of old fans of his RCA years in the U.S. who would've loved to have owned I Never Had It So Good, but again, Jack didn't give a single thought to his everyday American music fans, and didn't even make the CD available to them. He says that the U.S. is the target audience for the upcoming Bergman CD, but the only people who will be buying it are those few who see him regularly in concert - most other Americans don't even know who Jack is anymore, and he's done nothing to change that these last 2-3 decades.

I eventually came to understand for myself why Jack's former publicist, Peter Levinson, and producer Ken Barnes (in his Wives and Lovers/Dear Heart liner notes) spoke so disappointingly about Jack's attitude. There is one particular song that Jack recorded for Kapp that has generated much curiosity and urban legend over the past 40+ years. I decided to try and get some background information on it, so I wrote to Jack's production company, asking for Jack's reply. No reply ever came, of course, because the questions pertained to his Kapp years. I couldn't believe that someone who enjoyed such tremendous song selection with one record company could be so dismissive of it - and feel that he owes NOTHING to fans anymore regarding those songs.

I'm sincerely happy for you folks in the U.K. who've enjoyed a redemption of sorts from Jack, as he's FINALLY learned to appreciate fans. I also enjoy reading of your concert experiences, and your great singer-audience relationship. But just to provide a little perspective here, that's NOT how Jack Jones has been towards his American fans, and he's not regarded as important or beloved in America. Oh well . . as the distinguished Mr. Barnes wrote, "mercurial" Jack chose his own path . . .

[Marian]

Gloria, your post gives an interesting insight as to possibly why Jack has never seemed to have the same following in the U.S. in the past as other great singers like Tony Bennett and Johnny Mathis.
Marian

[Mark Fox]

Gloria-you have said what I knew about JJ Stateside. My US pals have never shared my liking for him and echo everything you've posted(&more).
I hope you haven't burst too many UK fans'bubbles.

[Marian]

Gloria, you can buy I Never Had it So good direct from Scotdisc Gloria, and I believe it is free postage worldwide.
Marian

[Mark Fox]

Welll...my USA friends also dislike Vic Damone-I'm not getting into deep waters on either artiste.Like I said,my US pals don't share my liking of Jack's music.
End of...!
I correspond regularly with Ken Barnes and his views on JJ are as Gloria says.

[Terence Lee]

May I say how shocked I am to read Gloria's post.
That wasn't very wise of JJ to alienate his American fans when so many singers from the UK are anxious to break into the American market. Think Sir Cliff Richard & Dame Shirley Bassey in the past and Gary Barlow, Ronan Keating & Robbie Williams right now to name just a few.

[mariana44]

Quiite a few surprises there. I can only speak of another US singer, Johnny Mathis, who I have seen well over 100 times in UK-but also well over 50 times in US---at the US concerts that I have been to , the fans seem to genuinely really love him still.

But strangely enough, he now has no official fan club -either in US or, as from just this summer, no longer in the Uk.

I find this amazing, as he still has the pulling power to attract over 10000 fans to the MENA--well, that was 3 years ago, but I cannot see it changing.

[Terence Lee]

Mariana, I am surprised that Johnny Mathis no longer has an official fan club while Engelbert is still going strong around the world with many many fan clubs. Some singers do not encourage fan clubs. This is certainly the case of Shirley Bassey who irked some fans when she remarked that it freaks her out to see the same old faces in the front rows. That was not a very wise thing to say of faithful fans who queue for hours to get the best seats.

[Gloria]

Marian: The Jack Jones Forum seems to be there for enthusiastic concert posts, so there'd be no point in my disturbing that. Besides, it's not my intention to spoil everyone's fun exchange, or to deny that Jack is a great entertainer.

I just happened to notice some points in the UK reviews that were amusing to me, due to the cultural differences we have in definiing JJ. And I also noticed that Jack was once again undermining Kapp, in the radio link you posted, saying that his producer was "slapping his hand" whenever he deviated from a pure pop sound. Jack needs to SERIOUSLY give this point a break. After all, pop singers were not yet exploring much jazz fusion in the early-60s. And since Jack's voice was smooth and beautiful at the time, female fans expected a beautiful, romantic sound from him. Dave Kapp, understandably, wanted to give the fans what they wanted. But arranger Marty Paich, with his extensive jazz background, had to argue much with Kapp about taking Jack in a jazzier direction. In retrospect, however, this was understandable; it's taken decades for fans and historians to fully appreciate just how gifted Paich was in fusing his own jazz style with commercial pop. It was not a popular direction at the time, and not even JJ nor Paich could've anticipated the phenomenon that was to come from their efforts: Impossible Dream tapped into the young, MALE record-buying public and gave Jack his all-time best-selling album. Jack should be proud of this, that he explored jazz even earlier than Bennett did. But the pop recordings were all great too. How can fans listen to these albums and believe Jack, that the Kapps didn't know what they were doing? Jack should be a better man, and acknowledge all the great things that Dave and Mickey Kapp did for him - the albums are destined to do just that long after Jack is gone.

[Marian]

I agree about the JJ forum Gloria. When I mentioned it, it was very much 'tongue in cheek.'
When I first joined Jack's fan club, which was later changed to the Jack Jones Music Appreciation Society, it was a thriving club run from the U.S. with a very involved American President and Vice President, a U.K Representative, as well as a Representative in the Philippines. There were regular newsletters and get togethers that Jack always attended, and a glossy covered yearbook covering all the events from the year. This went on for years, so Jack must have had a healthy following of fans in America in those days.
What a shame it all changed. Although the club no longer exists, Jack's wife always kept in touch, writing a regular newsletter relating all the Jones family were doing and a yearly photo of the family at Christmastime.
We have photos of Jack and Kim's daughter Nicole from birth to her present 18 years of age. I don't think there can be many other stars who would do that for their fans.
We still get emails.
Marian

[Gloria]

Sounds like you have a great collection of photos and information to treasure, Marian. I don't hear of any celebrity fan clubs anymore. I guess it's a sign of the times - people have cut back on all those non-essential fees, as well as the travel costs, those clubs used to entail.

Most American summer amphitheatres went up in the early-70's, once the local halls and arenas became exclusively rock 'n' roll or disco settings. They also replaced the disappearing TV variety and talk shows that singers used to get exposure through. I can't recall a single summer when Johnny Mathis wasn't playing at one of the two amphitheatres in my area. More than any other singer, he recognized early on that he could maintain a steady fan base this way, year after year, recording and promoting new albums, and a fan club wouldn't be necessary anymore.

[mariana44]

It was not the fan's wishes for the Johnny Mathis fan clubs to disappear, both in US and Uk---it was down to management really. My friends and I would willingly pay to have our JM fan club restored--I was lucky to be part of the Fan club when it was at it's best and most active, and I am grateful for that.

Like Marian with JJ, I have many happy memories of my years with the JM fan club. Several of my friends still travel 3 or 4 times a year to see JM in concert in US--and if I could , so would I .

[paul jh]

May I say how shocked I am to read Gloria's post.
That wasn't very wise of JJ to alienate his American fans when so many singers from the UK are anxious to break into the American market. Think Sir Cliff Richard & Dame Shirley Bassey in the past and Gary Barlow, Ronan Keating & Robbie Williams right now to name just a few.

Gary Barlow, Ronan Keating, and Robbie Williams may have wanted to break into the US market ten years ago, but they have no interest now. Helen Reddy said the only way to break into the US market is to live there. So Robbie did that and he still couldn't achieve any success. The American audience will never get him. So I truly feel he's given up on making it in the US.

Others just choose to forget the US market for other reasons. Gabrielle did a tour of the US radio stations after her song Dreams made the US top 40. Many radio DJs would remark that she was a black lady singing a pop song (thinking that was odd). She never heard anything so ridiculous; she makes the music from her heart and that her fans would like and doesn't believe in categories. So after that, she completely wrote off the US market. She still has American fans, but they travel to the UK (or other European countries) to see her.

My opinion is that Jack Jones lost his singing credibility with Americans when he recorded the Love Boat Theme (which I hated). But I certainly remembered his hit songs from the 60s (still love Lollipops and Roses) and discovered his great recordings of If You Go Away, Watch What Happens, and others after purchasing a CD at the legendary (and much missed) Tower Records at Piccadilly Circus.

I think Johnny Mathis's American fans are still very dedicated; I know a few. Plus his 1970s recording of Too Much Too Little Too Late got him new and younger fans. He appeared at Wolf Trap Farm Park in Viriginia last summer. I would imagine it was a sell-out.

[Gloria]

Jack Jones did indeed lose much credibility with his Love Boat Theme recording. I hated the song too, but at the same time, I felt that the American media was rather cruel in how they assessed JJ's worth over one song. After all, there was so much tackiness to be found in 70's entertainment, in general, and The Love Boat Theme seemed to be such a tiny dot in the big picture. But the strange thing is, Jack now seems happier being remembered for The Love Boat Theme than just about anything he recorded for Kapp, which leaves you wondering . . . maybe those critics were right about Jack after all.